Turbo - red circle of death, perhaps a fix for my car... but battery idle issue

[CHP]

28/11/2024: brand new turbo.

Hi byebye, sorry to hear about your problems.

Unfortunately red circle of death is more common than 1 member on the forum constantly want us to believe. It's simply wrong. I had two lemons and both taken back (last concluded yesterday) by dealer without any problems. @Petzi calculate minimum fault rate if you can. Simple probability calculation for one customer receiving two lemons.

I have no idea how leasing rights work but you may want to contact FirstEV directly. He had a similar experience.

Like you I didn't believe the software update would fix all problems. I explained the rational of my assumption in writing but agreed to follow dealer's proposal as they are the experts and were absolutely confident that software would fix the problem. I allowed them to keep the car as long as needed (I was provided with loaner) but made clear that I would return car without further discussion if fault would reoccur. The dealer agreed. The end is pretty obvious ;-).

The Macan is amazing to drive and my Porsche dealer has been brilliant. Porsche Germany support and communication for their electric cars however is suboptimal and certainly does not meet expectations. I am pretty sure Porsche is aware of this but mangers tend to like cutting costs for IT and customer services to increase their bonuses.

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[Petzi]

haha thats something. pretending that i am the minority.

 

[CHP]

I simply singled you out for always brushing off other forum members concerns. Numbers of those with problem are still stistcically small but there is no need to minoritize them.

On a second note, majority of those who did encounter more significant problems with Macan EV complain about poor handling of faults by Porsche.

 

[TurboSpain]

I think there's a lot of misinformation about how our cars' batteries are managed. Neither Porsche (nor any other brand) provides details on how the battery is managed and the power consumption of its various components. It's truly outrageous that this information isn't provided to the rightful owners. That said, I'd like us to have access to reliable data on the causes of energy loss and to know what limits are considered normal and what aren't.

My car loses about 1% of its energy daily. I'm aware that a parked and locked vehicle consumes energy. The key is how much energy is "normal."

(The app isn't useful for checking this data because it doesn't update the information until the doors are unlocked. You have to open the car and check the SoC)

Facts:

There are known energy-consuming components:
- Alarm/immobilizer: permanently connected
- Wireless communications (5G): the car periodically connects to the Porsche central station
- Comfort access: constantly listens for the key being nearby
- When the car is locked, it continues to power various components for 30 minutes. For example, my dashcam.
- BMS (Battery Management System): It constantly monitors the battery, this could be the biggest energy consumer (I'm not sure).
- The battery's own chemistry consumes energy in the form of heat: my garage is currently at 12 degrees, but the battery is at 18 degrees
- Our car has dozens of ECUs (Engine Control Units), but I don't know how many are operational and consuming energy.

There are surely more energy consumers that I'm unaware of. The question is whether we can calculate this consumption.

A Raspberry Pi 5 can consume about 18W. Would it be reasonable for the car's electronics to be equivalent to about two Raspberry Pis? In that case, we would have 18W x 2 x 24h = 864Wh/day. If the SoH were 93kWh, that would represent almost 1% of daily consumption.

Is this calculation reasonable?

What do you think? Can anyone provide technical information about the energy-consuming components?

 

[Petzi]

i am really sorry to disappoint again. but my turbo is parked right now in my garage in Vianna. I left for miami two weeks ago. i parked with 60%. today it has 60%. it is not attached to an charger.

 

[TurboSpain]

As I said:

(The app is useless for verifying this data because it doesn't update the information until the doors are unlocked. You have to open the car and check the SoC.)

I'm not saying that a 1% daily loss is normal, at least not without supporting data. But I can say that a 0% loss is not normal; in fact, it's impossible. Keep in mind that even a disconnected battery loses charge over time.

 

[Petzi]

As I said:

(The app is useless for verifying this data because it doesn't update the information until the doors are unlocked. You have to open the car and check the SoC.)

I'm not saying that a 1% daily loss is normal, at least not without supporting data. But I can say that a 0% loss is not normal; in fact, it's impossible. Keep in mind that even a disconnected battery loses charge over time.

the app says: "just tpdated"

 

[TurboSpain]

the app says: "just tpdated"

Sorry @Petzi, but you shouldn't look here.

You should look here.

Anyway, forget the app. To check the SoC status, you have to unlock the car, sit down, and start it.

One thing's for sure: the car consumes energy while stationary (all cars do it, even ICE cars). How much energy? I don't know; I'd like more information to find out.

 

[CHP]

Sorry @Petzi, but you shouldn't look here.

You should look here.

Anyway, forget the app. To check the SoC status, you have to unlock the car, sit down, and start it.

One thing's for sure: the car consumes energy while stationary (all cars do it, even ICE cars). How much energy? I don't know; I'd like more information to find out.

That's interesting. Never noticed before. There must be a reason why it is not updated. In my previous ICE car, online car services obviously were operated via low voltage battery. Do Macan EVs have same functionality? I unfortunately can't check as it isn't my car anymore (they forgot to disable connection so can still see car on app) but would be interesting to see if, when you start the car, the battery on the app get's updated.

 

[TurboSpain]

when you start the car, the battery on the app get's updated.

Yes, that's right. The information usually updates when you unlock the doors. Although sometimes it doesn't.
The most reliable way to check the SoC is to sit in the car and start it.

 

[CHP]

Yes, that's right. The information usually updates when you unlock the doors. Although sometimes it doesn't.
The most reliable way to check the SoH is to sit in the car and start it.

Assuming this functionality is to preserve battery, would be interesting to see if those reporting loss of around 1 kWh/day have more frequent updates on the app.

Can't recall if we concluded on deep sleep mode but this may be an explanation. Wonder if significant temperature changes below or above optimal temperature window would trigger wake up to get more accurate information. My car is apparently idle since 5th of October (obviously not sure if they opened doors) and battery was updated 3 days ago on app.

 

[Petzi]

@TurboSpain sorry again. but you are wrong. 1.) this has nothing to do with SoH. 2.) my data has been updated „one day ago“. nobody opened any door or started the car. the car is switched off of course. and yes it needs some energy which it gets from the 12v battery „like any other car“. (like any other car including ice, the 12v battery can do this for weeks. should it get drained below a certain level, the high voltage battery will recharge it.

 

[CHP]

All of three cases show different update dates: 1, 3 and 5 days since last update. Either software it is set up to this at 5+ days intervals or something is triggering this. I have no idea how many modules are measuring high voltage battery capacity and charging state and how they are connected. As @Petzi is as confident about this as Porsche dealer are about software updates fixing all problems I wonder if he could point us to technical details.

 

[TurboSpain]

1.) this has nothing to do with SoH

Yes, sorry for the typo (SoC)

I don't want to start a debate. If someone thinks an EV doesn't lose energy over two weeks, good for them. That's not the case with my car, and I don't think it's the case with most others either. There's a lot of information out there about other EVs, but for Porsche in particular, there isn't much data.

For example, this article summarizes it like this:
https://chargerigs.com/do-electric-cars-lose-charge-when-parked/

It doesn't matter if the energy comes from the auxiliary battery or the main battery, since the auxiliary is charged with the main. We also don't know how the Macan calculates the SoC (because it's a calculation based on the cells, not a direct measurement), but what is certain is that there is power consumption.
The Macan user manual says that it should be left connected to a charger if it's going to be parked for a while. There must be a reason for this recommendation.

 

[ChrisFromUK]

Just to add another data point, just got into mine after 7 days idle.

Left the car at 79% and after 7 days when I got in it was 69%.

@TurboSpain is correct that the SoC via the app is useless and has been reporting the battery still at 79% right up until I got into the car.

Although I didn't do it this time, I think you can force the car to update the SoC shown in the app by using the app to change to battery charge limit %. Sending this to the car has in the past forced the car to report an updated SoC to the app.

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